Dining with Donna and Mia Podcast: Ingredient Replacements

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In this practical episode of Dining with Donna and Mia, Donna J. Jodhan explains that she put her Dining with Donna podcast on hiatus for a year because she felt something new was needed, and that she revived it as Dining with Donna and Mia after Mia Maceášik, who was sitting next to her at a meeting, agreed to join. Mia, an outdoor educator and accessibility consultant based in Toronto, Ontario, who worked in private home care as a personal support worker, then talks about ingredient replacements, also called ingredient substitutions: swapping one ingredient for another in a recipe, such as applesauce or mashed banana in place of eggs or a fat, always one-to-one. Mia, who is allergic to casein, a protein in dairy, explains how to read labels for whey, casein and milk solids, how to find a dairy-free butter that works, and says a dairy-free replacement for condensed milk has not turned up yet.

When Donna, who loves pork, chicken and condensed milk but is not too crazy about black beans, asks about vegan and dairy-free cooking and where fish fits in, Mia explains that vegans cook without any animal products, recommends a slow transition with options such as Beyond Meat burgers, a meatless Monday or a hearty vegetable stew, and describes how a sensory need, such as Mia’s dislike of raw celery, can be met by replacing an ingredient. Mia also covers allergy testing with a specialist, checking labels for food made in the same facility as an allergen, the difference between tree nuts and peanuts, which belong to the legume family, using a person rather than AI to translate a label in another language, and replacing nuts with pumpkin or sunflower seeds, adding that baking with sunflower or other seed butters can leave the color a little bit off while it still tastes good. The episode closes with Mia’s advice to embrace trial and error and have fun in the kitchen, and Donna says Mia will talk about low-calorie baking in December.

TRANSCRIPT

Podcast Commentator: [upbeat music] Greetings. Donna J. Jodhan and Mia Maceášik invite you to draw culinary inspiration from their podcast, Dining with Donna and Mia. Here, Donna and Mia serve up approachable, step-by-step recipes, kitchen hacks, and meal themes, from quick weeknight dinners to comfort food classics and healthy meal prep. With tips for cooking without relying on sight, using sound, touch, aroma, and smart tools, you’ll build confidence, cook safely, and enjoy every bite. You can expect budget-friendly ideas, seasonal specials, and the occasional guest chef. If this makes you hungry, grab your apron, subscribe, and let’s get cooking one delicious, accessible meal at a time. Now, let’s dive into today’s episode.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Welcome to the Dining with Donna podcast. Now, this podcast was put on hiatus last year because I honestly felt that something new was needed. Something was missing, and I wasn’t totally happy with just having recipes, reciting recipes, and giving salads and desserts and all kinds of things. No, no, no. It was too mundane. So I took a year off and decided that, you know what, I’m going to be very, very patient and wait until something comes up where I think it will be unique and it will make things a little different because so many people are putting out recipes and telling you how to cook and how to bake. So I’m hoping that the Dining with Donna show, soon to be renamed or will be renamed as of today, Dining with Donna and Mia, and I’m going to tell you why.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I’m hoping that this is going to be something unique, exciting, and interesting, okay? So this show has been revived, and I got lucky a few months ago because I was at a meeting with two other associates, and I happened to bring up Dining with Donna and how badly I really, really wanted to do something about this show. And lo and behold, sitting right next to me was the answer. Her name is Mia, and I will let her pronounce her last name to you. And Mia is going to be a refreshing addition to the Dining with Donna and Mia show. I really think it is. And like I said, I decided to bring Mia on because I think… No, I don’t think. I believe we have something to offer, something to share, and something very unique. So Mia, please introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about you.

Mia Maceášik: Hello, everyone. My name is Mia Maceášik, and I’m an outdoor educator and also an accessibility consultant based in Toronto, Ontario. So in my younger years, I worked in private home care as a PSW, which stands for personal support worker, and that really helped me through my psychology degree and then into a role as a community engagement specialist. So I worked with nursing students in an outdoor kind of land-based community health promotion clinical placement. So I love talking to people, I love being outside, I love accessibility, and I love cooking and baking.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Right. And I’m so pleased to have you aboard. Like I said, this is my good luck that day when I just brought it up, and she did not hesitate. She said, “Oh, yeah, I’ll join your shows,” and here she is. So for our first show, Mia is gonna talk about ingredient replacements, and I’ll let her take it away and tell you all about it. And after that, I will ask her some questions. So go, Mia, go.

Mia Maceášik: Awesome. Thank you so much, Donna. Okay. So for this episode, we’re gonna be talking a little bit about ingredient replacements, also called ingredient substitutions. So what exactly is that, right? It’s the practice of swapping out one ingredient for another ingredient in a recipe. An example that I like to use is applesauce or mashed banana can be used in many baked goods in place of eggs or in place of a fat, like butter or oil. But one thing to remember is that when you’re replacing ingredients with another ingredient, it’s only one-to-one, right? So for example, if I’m replacing eggs with mashed banana, I can only replace eggs with that other ingredient, but not another fat in that recipe, right? ‘Cause then it’s gonna be too much banana [laughs] in whatever you’re baking.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I don’t like bananas. Ugh. But anyway, continue on, my dear.

Mia Maceášik: Yeah, so that was just an example. So if you don’t like bananas, you could use applesauce or another blended fruit product, right? But the thing is it’s a one-to-one replacement. Okay. So that’s an important thing to know. If it’s not a one-to-one replacement and you’re trying to replace three or four different things in that recipe with one thing, that’s not going to [laughs] turn out too well. Yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay, continue on. I’m listening. [laughs]

Mia Maceášik: Okay. Now, let’s think of a couple of questions. How does this relate to dairy-free cooking? Now, I myself, I have a dairy allergy. Although I’m not allergic to all components in dairy, I’m allergic to a protein in dairy called casein. Right? Casein.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: What is that?

Mia Maceášik: So it’s a protein that’s found in dairy products. Not just in cow milk. So when we think of dairy, we think of dairy comes from cows, [laughs] right?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And goats.

Mia Maceášik: Or goats or things like that. But I can’t have dairy that comes from any animal. Very, very unfortunate. [laughs] But I’ve been that way since I was a baby, basically, so I don’t really know the difference anyway. Right? Now, going back to this idea of dairy-free cooking and replacing things, a lot of dairy substitutes have nuts in it. That can be a problem. Some people who have a dairy allergy can also have nut allergies. Or if you need to bake something for your friend group and you need to take into consideration their dietary restrictions, then there’s going to be a lot of label reading involved, [laughs] a lot of reading labels. So now, what are we looking for on labels? What are we looking for in the ingredients list when we want to not have dairy products and not have nut products in our foods? You’re looking for whey and derivatives, so anything that has the word whey in it. Okay? Casein, caseinate. Hydrolyzed casein is a popular one. And of course—

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Can you spell those for our listeners, please?

Mia Maceášik: Oh, yes. So whey is spelled W-H-E-Y. And casein is C-A-S-E-I-N. Yes. So any terms that have those words in them, you’d want to avoid, right? One of the most common dairy ingredients that I see in products is milk solids and powders. So that looks like non-fat dry milk, skim milk powder, condensed milk, buttermilk, things like that.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Well, I love condensed milk. [laughs]

Mia Maceášik: [laughs] Many people do. And it is so difficult to find something to replace condensed milk in a recipe. I actually still haven’t found really a dairy-free thing to replace condensed milk. Like, if you’re making a tres leches cake or something that’s all dairy based, I haven’t found anything [laughs] to really replace those dairy-based ingredients yet. I’m still… It’s trial and error in baking. And that’s what’s fun about baking, it’s trial error. Sometimes more error. [laughs] But that’s the fun of it.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: It’s the only way to learn though, right?

Mia Maceášik: Of course, yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yeah. Okay. Go on.

Mia Maceášik: I make a lot of cultural dishes from my own culture. So I make Slovak dishes and I make some Filipino dishes, too. Yeah. They use a lot of dairy [laughs] in their baking. A lot of dairy. So what I tend to do is that I buy dairy-free vegan butter. And that usually covers it. Right? And the thing is, though, you need to find a brand that works for you. So you might have to trial three or four different dairy-free butter brands. And find one that works best in whatever recipe you’re making. Yeah. It’s all up to personal taste and what you like, right? [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: But do people really understand what ingredient replacement is all about? And how much do they really know?

Mia Maceášik: That’s actually such a good question. Right? And I feel like a lot of people don’t think about replacing ingredients until they have to. Right? So until they encounter something like an allergy. They might develop an allergy to something, and in that process, right, they’re gonna have to eliminate a lot of foods.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Oh, darn.

Mia Maceášik: So during that process they have to eliminate everything [laughs] that they used to like and find new ways to cook those things. Yeah. And that’s a process I had to go through several times in my health journey. [laughs] It’s quite a journey. But it also really does force you to be creative in a lot of ways. Yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: What about dairy-free cooking? Are people conscious of wanting to do it? And if so, why would they want to do it?

Mia Maceášik: So for some people, it might be transitioning to becoming vegan. So I’ve seen that a lot. So they might be cutting out dairy transitioning into a new way of eating. So they might be going vegan, right? So that’s one consideration. And another one is women who have kids that are allergic to dairy, and they’re in the process of breastfeeding their baby.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Tell us more.

Mia Maceášik: So when I was a little baby, I had to have formula special ordered. [laughs] Right? Like a completely dairy-free thing, right? So if a woman is breastfeeding and she consumes dairy, and the baby has a dairy allergy, that wouldn’t work.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Well, what exactly is vegan cooking? Tell us more. I mean, I am a little bit… I don’t know too much about it, but tell us.

Mia Maceášik: Yeah. So vegan cooking means cooking without any animal products. Yeah, so personally, I’m not vegan at the moment. I was for quite a bit, though. I was for quite a bit. But unfortunately, some health issues came up, and I had to leave that lifestyle. But yeah, so that’s eliminating animal products from your diet. And what a lot of people do when they’re transitioning into a vegan diet or a vegan lifestyle is that they have to slowly cut down, right? You don’t wanna go cold turkey, [laughs] as they say, and just completely cut out everything when you’re used to eating animal products for your whole life, right? So it’s a slow transition. So they will try to cut out some dairy products first, some meat products first, and then introduce some dairy substitute into their diet.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: But if you start cutting out animal products, what am I gonna eat? Excuse me.

Mia Maceášik: Great question. Yeah. So there’s great, great, great, great meat replacers and dairy alternatives out now, whereas, for example, when I was a child growing up with a dairy allergy in the ’90s, [laughs] there was not too much available. There really was not too much available in terms of, like, dairy replacers. That was a very interesting time to grow up with allergies [laughs] was in the ’90s. I mean, I laugh about it now looking back on it. But anyways, yeah. So you can replace meat and animal products and dairy in your diet with things like Beyond Meat, right? So that is a specific brand, and they make very, very good hamburgers that have zero animal products in them. It tastes exactly like a hamburger. [laughs] It really, really is amazing.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: But I love pork. I like pork. How do I deal with that?

Mia Maceášik: You’re not going to find a pork replacement that is going to taste exactly like pork. During that process, it’s getting used to new tastes, I would say.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Well, I’m out of luck.

Mia Maceášik: [laughs] Although you can go online and search up some vegan recipes and just try out, like I said before, trial and error. Right? You might find out you really are into beans, and there’s so many things that you can do with beans. I actually did a batch of brownies the other day with black beans. And it tasted really good. [laughs] Yeah. So there’s a lot of options out there. And I actually tried a dairy-free cheese that was made with cashews. Now, I don’t exactly know, or I don’t remember what a dairy-based cheese tastes like, so I can’t [laughs] really compare the two, right? But I had my parents try it, and they said it tasted like an actual cheese, so.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: If I don’t know what I’m eating, and you give me this, would I be able to tell the difference? [laughs]

Mia Maceášik: Honestly, probably. It depends. Although I have gotten to the level of baking where I’m good enough with dairy replacers that a lot of people can’t tell [laughs] that I took the dairy out of a recipe. But then again, it depends on a recipe. Like, if you’re doing something that is traditionally dairy based, right, like milk bread, then of course you can tell [laughs] that there’s no dairy product in that. But then if you’re doing something like an apple pie, you most likely won’t be able to tell that it’s a dairy-free apple pie.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Oh. Now, where does fish, excuse me, where does fish fit into all of this? As far as vegan cooking?

Mia Maceášik: Okay, so vegans who are strict vegan don’t eat fish, okay? ‘Cause that’s to them considered an animal. Some people are pescatarian, so that means they do eat fish but then they don’t eat other animals, such as cows, or they don’t eat pork. Right? So they’re kind of vegetarian, but with fish. That’s what a pescatarian diet is, right? I, for one—

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I’m not sure that I would—

Mia Maceášik: I love fish. I think it’s great too.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I do too. I’m not sure that I would make a good vegan person here, because I love pork. I love chicken. [laughs] Anyway, so continue on. Tell us a bit more about—

Mia Maceášik: You could do a meatless Monday or occasionally a meat-free meal, right? If you’re into that.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Give us an example of a meat-free meal. Tell us.

Mia Maceášik: Yes. Okay. A good bean stew, a good veggie stew with a really nice bread. That’s a meal in and of itself. I am a huge fan of soup as a meal. Especially since we’re going into winter, right? We’re going into winter. It’s gonna be cold. A nice hearty stew, a nice veggie stew. You don’t need to put any meat in there. Could just be all good, hearty vegetables. You could put squash. You could put beans. You could put corn in there, carrots, right? With a vegetable stock which you can buy at the grocery store. Once again, check the labels. Or you could do a veggie stock from scratch. Personally, I like buying my stock rather than making it, since it’s quite a long process to do a veggie stock, or to do any stock or broth, right? But yeah, a good hearty vegetable stew is really nice with some bread. Homemade or bakery-bought is fine. [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Give us a quick recipe for a great vegetable stew. Tell us what you’d put into it.

Mia Maceášik: I feel that every veggie stew has to have a main vegetable that’s kind of like the centerpiece for the stew. If that makes sense. Right? So if you’re making a veggie stew, think of some type of more carbohydrate dense veggie or starch veggie that you can put in there. Okay, so a potato. A squash, a pumpkin.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I like all that. Yeah. Squash.

Mia Maceášik: In fact, you could put all of those things into your stew. Mushrooms are a little bit controversial texture-wise. So if you’re cooking for somebody who has sensory needs, mushrooms can be a little bit of a sensory scare [laughs] in your stew if it comes out a little bit mushy, right? And so some people have a sensitivity to that. Yeah, you can put tomatoes in there or omit the tomatoes if you’re doing a low nightshade. Right? Some people are sensitive to nightshades, like peppers or tomatoes. It’s okay. You don’t need to put that in, right? You can replace that with some carrots. Okay.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: What are sensory needs?

Mia Maceášik: You can replace that with something else.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: What are sensory needs? Tell me more.

Mia Maceášik: Yeah. Everyone has a sensory need, okay? Everyone has a food that they don’t like for some reason, I think. What are some foods that you don’t like because of the texture or because of the taste?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Beans. I don’t care for beans.

Mia Maceášik: What kind of bean?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I don’t—

Mia Maceášik: Is there a specific kind or just across the board, like any?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: No. I like red beans. I like lima beans, but black beans, I’m not too crazy about. I just don’t like it.

Mia Maceášik: Is there a reason for that, like the taste or is it the texture?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Might be the texture that I’m not too crazy about.

Mia Maceášik: Yeah. And that’s a sensory need, right? So in a recipe, if I was making a stew for you or I was making a chili, I would just omit the black beans and then replace it with something that you like with a texture that you find that’s more pleasing to eat. Yeah. And for myself, I have this thing about celery. Celery for me is perfectly fine in a soup or a stew. I don’t like it if it’s by itself. Like, raw celery and the whole business of dipping it [laughs] and eating the raw celery. I don’t like it, the texture, the ridges on the celery stick. Sensorily, I don’t like that texture. [laughs] So instead of that, I’ll cut up a bell pepper and eat that instead, right? You don’t have to eat something that you don’t like. Right? Yes, it’s important to try new foods, but if you try something and you don’t like it, find a replacement for it. It’s a whole trial and error again.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: So what you’re telling me, there is always a replacement for something you don’t like. Is that it?

Mia Maceášik: Yes. Yes, in most cases. It’s easier to find a replacement for something you don’t like than it is to find replacement for something you do like.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay. I hear you.

Mia Maceášik: So I’ll give you an example.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yes, please.

Mia Maceášik: Once again, I don’t eat dairy, like any dairy at all from any animal. ‘Cause I can’t, ’cause of my allergy. When I have a birthday, I have to order a birthday cake that everyone is going to like. [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Oh. Give us an example.

Mia Maceášik: I don’t make my own birthday cakes. I special order them because I wanna be fancy. It’s my birthday. Everyone I know, like my parents, my friends, they eat dairy. They’re able to eat dairy. So I need to find something that tastes as good as a cake with dairy in it. Right? But then again, I can’t tell the difference, right? So I don’t know. I’ll only find out [laughs] if it tastes like a cake with dairy in it if I give it to them and they’re like, “Oh, this tastes like a regular cake.” Then I’m like, “Oh, okay. Then it’s a good cake.” Right?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: But do you think people really care about dairy-free cakes as opposed to a dairy cake? Like, are people conscious of that?

Mia Maceášik: Not usually, but if they have a friend or family member, then they start to realize how much stuff actually has dairy in it. Right? Like, I have friends who I hang out with quite often. They start to read ingredient labels on things, and they’re like, “I had no idea how much dairy is in sauces or in candy or in things that you would never in a million years think would have dairy in it.” Right? Like hot sauce or chewing gum. I’ve seen chewing gum that has dairy product in it. So unless you’re kind of confronted with this idea of going dairy-free, there’s no real reason for just an average individual [laughs] to really look at dairy on labels.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: But do you think people are reading labels more today than they did, say, five years ago?

Mia Maceášik: Absolutely, yes. Because label- because I think are made more accessible now.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yeah, yeah. And you know that when they do their commercials on TV and their advertisements, you are made aware of things that you weren’t made aware of a few years ago, right? Now, if I have allergies and I want to make sure that my cookies and cakes do not affect my allergies, are there such things as allergy-friendly substitutes that I can use?

Mia Maceášik: Yes. Now, this is important, this next part. If you have an emerging allergy, okay, and you know what it is. Let’s just for example say you know what it is, like 100% sure. You gotta look at labels on basically everything you buy because you don’t know if it may have come into contact with or been made in the same facility as your allergen. Yeah, and I used to work with kids a lot in summer camp programming. I would look at every single label, and if it says, “Made in a factory that processes nuts,” or, “Made in a factory that processes dairy,” or shellfish, whatever allergy it was, then I would not use that, ’cause you don’t know what level of cross-contamination may happen. And some people with their allergies, for example, I can handle a little bit of cross-contamination. Some people absolutely can’t. They have very severe allergies. Yeah, so it’s about knowing yourself if you can handle some cross-contamination and how much cross-contamination you’re able to versus no cross-contamination at all. You just have to have a completely allergen-free kitchen.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: How do I know that I have an allergy?

Mia Maceášik: You gotta go talk to your doctor [laughs] and they gotta do allergy tests. You gotta get a—

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: A test.

Mia Maceášik: Referral to an allergy specialist. I have the same allergy specialist as I did when I was born. I’m 34 now, so I don’t know how old he is. [laughs] Right? Same person, same doctor. But you do need to undergo allergen testing. That is important, okay? ‘Cause you could be allergic to more than one thing.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yeah, definitely so.

Mia Maceášik: Yeah, and it’s important to find out the extent of your allergy as well.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Anaphylactic.

Mia Maceášik: And you might be anaphylactic, you might not be.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: But what should I be looking for when I read the list of ingredients on a label?

Mia Maceášik: Okay. For example, if you have a nut allergy, you have to make sure that on that label thing that you’re buying is not processed in the same facility as your allergen.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay. Give me an example.

Mia Maceášik: Okay. If you’re buying a package of, let’s just say, walnuts. Let’s say you’re buying a package of walnuts, and you’re not allergic to walnuts. A walnut is a tree nut. Okay, let’s say you have a peanut allergy. You gotta look on that label and make sure that those walnuts were not processed in the same facility as peanuts. Some people have an allergy to both peanuts and tree nuts. Some people have an allergy just to peanuts or just to tree nuts, right? But you gotta be reading that whole label. And the thing is that it’s going to be at the bottom of that label, [laughs] so you gotta read through the whole thing. A lot of the times it’s not the first thing you’re gonna read. A lot of the times it’s gonna be at the bottom, but I have seen some products where it’s at the top. Yeah. It’s happening more now, more ingredient transparency. Yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: So there’s a difference between peanuts and tree nuts, right?

Mia Maceášik: Yes, yes. There absolutely is. A lot of people don’t know that, but— [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: I don’t.

Mia Maceášik: There is. I learned that through working as a personal support worker for a while, yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Give us some example of tree nuts.

Mia Maceášik: Okay, a tree nut, it’s in the name, so it’s anything that grows on a tree. Any nut that grows on a tree. The most common example that I like to give people is a walnut. So walnuts grow on trees. They’re beautiful trees. Here in Ontario, we actually have what’s called the black walnut, which is a native species. Very good, very tasty. [laughs] But that is a tree nut, okay? An almond is a tree nut. Cashews are a tree nut. Hazelnuts, macadamia nuts, pecans, or pecans. Pecans or pecans, [laughs] however you wanna pronounce that. And pistachios. Pistachios are also a tree nut. Peanuts are not tree nuts. They belong to what’s called the legume family.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And what is the legume family? It grows in the ground, or… I’m a bit naive when it comes to that.

Mia Maceášik: Okay, the family of legumes are things like chickpea, soybean, lentils, peanuts. Oh, edamame. Edamame is also a kind of soybean, related. Yeah. So legume, you think of your beans. Right? Some people who are allergic to peanuts are allergic to chickpeas. Yeah, I had a friend in college who was allergic to peanuts, and they also couldn’t have any hummus. Right? Because they were allergic to chickpeas. [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay, so that’s a family of legumes, right? And that’s spelled L-A-G-O-O-N-H?

Mia Maceášik: L-E, L-E-G-U-M-E-S.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Oh, legumes. Okay. All right. Okay. If I want to cook different cultural dishes, and at the same time I want to make sure that my allergies are not affected, what types of things should I be considering?

Mia Maceášik: Now, this is going to sound very odd, but I have experience as a person who is multi-ethnic. Now, if you are cooking a recipe from your culture, you might buy ingredients from, like, an ethnic food store or online. And that’s not in English sometimes. [laughs] So I feel like you see where I’m getting at. You need to find somebody who can read that label and tell you what exactly is on that label. Please don’t use AI for translating.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Oh, darn. [laughs]

Mia Maceášik: Yeah, don’t use AI for that. Please use a human. [laughs] Use a person to help you translate what’s on that label if you don’t read that language or if you can’t understand that language, right? Yeah, find a human to translate for you. That’s super important. Yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Okay. And if I want to make my dishes dairy-free, does this mean that an allergy substitute would make my dish less tasty?

Mia Maceášik: All right. I have thought quite a bit about this. Now, once again, I don’t know the difference. So for me, dairy-free ice cream, that’s how I understand ice cream to be. Okay. Now, I wouldn’t say that it would be less tasty, but it would be tasty in a different way. Okay. A lot of my friends who have tried dairy-free ice cream say that it’s good, but it’s different [laughs] than dairy ice cream, right? So it’s going to be tasty in a different way, in a different format, I’d say.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: More tasty, you would say, or less?

Mia Maceášik: It wouldn’t be more or less, just different. [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Different.

Mia Maceášik: So for some people, yeah, it might be less. Although dairy-free ice cream, I’ve heard some people say that it has, like, a texture to it. That takes some getting used to. But then once you get used to that texture, you might develop more of an affinity, a familiarity with it. So then it might be more tasty to you, [laughs] as you get used to that. But yeah, I wouldn’t say more or less tasty. I would just say that it’s tasty—

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Different.

Mia Maceášik: In a different way. In a different way. Absolutely, yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And what kind of substitutes can I consider to replace nuts if I have a nut allergy?

Mia Maceášik: Replace it with seeds.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Seeds. What kind of seeds?

Mia Maceášik: You can replace it with pumpkin seeds. Right? So pumpkin seeds have this nice little, little crunch. Or sunflower seeds. Now, I do have to say that if you are cooking with sunflower butter, like seed butters, it will definitely change the color of whatever you’re baking. [laughs] So if you’re making, let’s say, a banana bread or an apple bread that would traditionally have peanut butter in it and you’re replacing it with sunflower butter or pumpkin seed butter, that color is going to be different than if you would be cooking with peanut butter. And some new bakers would do that substitution and they’re like, “Why did the color turn out really weird?” [laughs] This strange brown-green, kind of odd gray maybe color. It’s just a chemical reaction that happens when you’re baking with certain seeds that might make the color a little bit off. But it still tastes good. It will definitely look a little bit strange, but it’s going to taste good. [laughs] Still gonna taste good. Yeah.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: All right. I think this is probably a wrap for this week. I’ve learnt a lot. I learnt about vegan cooking, I learnt about allergies. I hope our listeners enjoyed this first show, and there’s a lot more to come. So Mia, do you have any final comments to make before we wrap?

Mia Maceášik: I would just say trial and error. That’s the theme for today’s episode. Don’t be afraid to try new things. Okay. Yes. Try different brands. Go to the grocery store. Pick up a new ingredient that you might have always wanted to try but never got around to it. Try a new recipe that you found online. Yeah. Have fun in the kitchen. Cooking is meant to be fun.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: That’s right.

Mia Maceášik: It’s meant to be fun. It’s meant to make you happy. [laughs]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Yeah. You’re just not cooking. You’re chatting with others. You’re imagining things. You’re doing things. Yeah, cooking is meant to be fun. Yeah.

Mia Maceášik: Yeah. And in future episodes, we can talk about ways to make cooking less stressful, right?

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: Right on, yeah.

Mia Maceášik: We could talk about low-energy cooking. ‘Cause if you have low energy, you still gotta cook, but we could still make that fun. We could still make it exciting. Right? We gotta work with our abilities, I’d say. Right? We got a lot to talk about in future episodes.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: We do. But for next month, month of December, you are gonna be telling us about low-calorie baking. I can’t wait. [laughs]

Mia Maceášik: Yes. And I would say I have more experience in low-calorie baking than in nut-free baking, right? Yes. Especially, yeah, a lot of experience when I used to work in home care. And low-calorie baking is challenging, but we can simplify it. We’re gonna simplify it in next month’s episode.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: And especially for the month of December, my gosh, we got a lot to talk about, don’t we? [laughs]

Mia Maceášik: Absolutely.

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA: So this is it. This is our first wrap for November with Donna and Mia. [outro music]

Podcast Commentator: Thank you so much for listening. That’s a wrap for this episode of Dining with Donna and Mia. Donna and Mia want to hear from you. What did you cook? What worked? And what would you like to learn next? Share your favorite accessible kitchen tips, send in a recipe request, or tell us the kitchen challenge you’d like Donna and Mia to tackle on an upcoming episode. And if today’s show helped you feel more confident cooking without relying on sight, please share it with a friend and leave a review. Your support helps more listeners find their way into the kitchen. Until next time, keep it simple, keep it safe, and keep it delicious. [outro music]

Donna J. Jodhan, LLB, ACSP, MBA
Global Leader In Disability Rights, Digital Accessibility, And Inclusive Policy Reform
Turning policy into progress for people with disabilities.